Saturday, August 21, 2021

Socata TBM700, N700DT: Fatal accident occurred August 20, 2021 near Grimes Field Airport (I74), Urbana, Champaign County, Ohio

 Martin Beerman, MD

This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed. 

The National Transportation Safety Board traveled to the scene of this accident. 

Additional Participating Entity: 
Federal Aviation Administration / Flight Standards District Office; Columbus, Ohio


Location: Urbana, OH 
Accident Number: CEN21FA376
Date & Time: August 20, 2021, 14:40 Local
Registration: N700DT
Aircraft: Socata TBM 700
Injuries: 1 Fatal
Flight Conducted Under: Part 91: General aviation - Personal

Posted on Kathryn's Report
On August 20, 2021, about 1440 eastern daylight time, a Socata TBM 700A airplane, N700DT, was destroyed when it was involved in an accident near Urbana, Ohio. The pilot sustained fatal injuries. The airplane was operated as a Title 14 Code of Federal Regulations Part 91 personal flight.

Preliminary air traffic control information revealed the airplane was en route from the ErieOttawa Airport (PCW), Port Clinton, Ohio, to the Cincinnati Municipal Airport (LUK), Cincinnati, Ohio. The airplane departed runway 9 at PCW and climbed to flight level 200 before beginning to descend. The airplane was southbound, descending to 12,000 ft mean sea level (msl), and established communications with the assigned terminal radar approach control controller. The controller cleared the pilot to descent to 10,000 ft msl and proceed direct to LUK. While descending through 12,100 ft msl, the airplane entered a left turn. The controller observed the left turn and asked the pilot if everything was alright; there was no response from the pilot. Radar contact was subsequently lost with the airplane. The controller’s further attempts to establish communications were unsuccessful.

A witness, located about 2 miles south of the accident location, stated that he observed the airplane at a high altitude in a nose-dive descent toward the terrain. He reported the airplane was not turning or spinning; it was headed straight down. The witness observed no signs of distress, such as smoke, fire, or parts coming off the airplane, and he stated the airplane’s engine was at full throttle. The witness lost sight of the airplane as it descended behind some trees.

The accident site was located 1.3 miles northwest of the last radar contact. The accident site showed the airplane impacted trees, two powerlines, and the terrain in a left-wing low attitude. The initial ground scar, located in a residential yard, contained separated components of the left wing. The airplane crossed a highway, struck trees and a ditch, and then continued into mature potato and soybean fields. The airplane wreckage was scattered at a distance of about 2,050 ft along a measured magnetic heading of 275°.


According to acquaintances of the pilot, the pilot purchased the airplane about 9 days before the accident. Following the purchase, the pilot and a flight instructor completed several hours of ground school and 15.5 hours of dual instruction in the airplane.
Posted on Kathryn's Report

Aircraft and Owner/Operator Information

Aircraft Make: Socata
Registration: N700DT
Model/Series: TBM700A
Aircraft Category: Airplane
Amateur Built:
Operator: On file 
Operating Certificate(s) Held: None
Operator Designator Code:

Meteorological Information and Flight Plan

Conditions at Accident Site: VMC
Condition of Light: Day
Observation Facility, Elevation: KI74,1067 ft msl 
Observation Time: 14:55 Local
Distance from Accident Site: 2.5 Nautical Miles
Temperature/Dew Point: 28°C /20°C
Lowest Cloud Condition: Scattered / 4000 ft AGL 
Wind Speed/Gusts, Direction: / ,
Lowest Ceiling: 
Visibility: 10 miles
Altimeter Setting: 30.01 inches Hg
Type of Flight Plan Filed: IFR
Departure Point: Port Clinton, OH (PCW)
Destination: Cincinnati, OH (LUK)

Wreckage and Impact Information

Crew Injuries: 1 Fatal 
Aircraft Damage: Destroyed
Passenger Injuries: 
Aircraft Fire: None
Ground Injuries: 
Aircraft Explosion: None
Total Injuries: 1 Fatal 
Latitude, Longitude: 40.066464,-83.774502 (est)

Those who may have information that might be relevant to the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) investigation may contact them by email witness@ntsb.gov, and any friends and family who want to contact investigators about the accident should email assistance@ntsb.gov. You can also call the NTSB Response Operations Center at 844-373-9922 or 202-314-6290.

Dr. Martin H. Beerman
June 7, 1953 - August 20, 2021


Martin Howard Beerman, age 68, is a much-beloved husband, father, son, brother, friend, and physician caring for many patients over his long career exclusively in the greater Sandusky area. His life was tragically cut short on August 20 while flying his plane, which he loved to do.

Marty was the first child and soon-to-be big brother, born in Camden, NJ and living briefly in California before arriving in Dayton to become a lifelong Buckeye. He attended Cornell Heights grade school and briefly Fairview High School, then Meadowdale High School. Pre-med followed at Miami (of Ohio) University, and medical school at The Ohio State University. He interned at Yale New Haven Hospital, then returned to OSU for residency in internal medicine, and fellowship in gastroenterology. After completing his medical education he moved to Sandusky to join a practice in gastroenterology, and never left.

He was an avid fitness buff, running almost every morning before doing procedures and seeing patients. He also loved being on the water in Sandusky Bay and the pond, for water skiing (barefoot and otherwise), windsurfing, kite-boarding, swimming, cycling, and anything that would get him moving in the wind and water.

Wintertime brought many years of alpine skiing, then he never looked back after being converted to a fulltime snowboarder by his little brother.

Marty was also a true foodie and gourmet cook, and could always be found puttering around in the kitchen with exotic entrees, his famous Caesar salad, and delicious desserts. He loved to travel and trying new restaurants, but most of all, he enjoyed spending time with his family.

He is survived by his wife Karlynn Beerman, daughters Brooke Durnwald and Katie Campbell, son Trevor Durnwald, mother Joyce Kardon, brother David Beerman, and sisters Nancy Tashman and Beth Pomerantz. And also by Parker, his faithful furry companion, who was always curled up in his office.

He was preceded in death by Stanford Beerman and Charles M. Kardon.

Friends may call on Tuesday, August 24, 2021 from 2pm to 7pm in the Groff Funeral Homes & Crematory, 1607 E Perkins Ave, Sandusky. Private family services will be conducted. Interment will be 3pm, Wednesday, August 25, 2021 in Riverview Cemetery, Dayton, OH.

Memorial contributions may be made to Erie County Humane Society, 1911 Superior St, Sandusky, OH 44870 or Back to the Wild, 4504 Bardshar Rd, Castalia, OH 44824.

59 comments:

  1. Replies
    1. Clearly a horizontal ground intercept.

      People are careless in data interpretation. The last MLAT data point was up at 7,225 feet altitude. Local terrain is 1000 feet. There is no data for the final 6000 feet of the descent.

      The long skid through turf and across the surface of US-68 would be a smoking hole and broken up asphalt if the intercept with the ground was not nearly horizontal. Look at the videos and photos linked in other comments.

      It is just physics, not complicated. You can teach yourself the principle by throwing one of your shoes out in your yard. Vary your arm movement from a horizontal throw to a downward throw and observe the difference.

      Delete
    2. he probably hit some (high rising) trees in front of the estate before ground contact at the end of the estate

      Delete
  2. Long narrow ground scar beginning in homeowners grass before crossing US-68 is puzzling. Could it be from a wingtip? Compare street view reference image below to beginning of video:

    Reference image:
    https://goo.gl/maps/YWiLKfSixnRuc2ua9

    Video:
    https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/crews-responding-to-reported-airplane-crash-in-urbana/BFY3FAOHINFQNJ4MIQRA7ICWKU/

    See also photo 11, here:
    https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/photos-airplane-crash-of-us-68/4PYEIGYRSRD47OP3L2NS5EV3IY/

    Overall aerial video:
    https://www.whio.com/news/local/state-patrol-responding-report-plane-crash-near-urbana/V24ZT74AZZD7LG6AUHIOZVDLNU/

    More aerial photos:
    https://www.whio.com/news/state-patrol/7YD7VJN2URAQTPQPDJ6LE54X24/

    Witness driving:
    “When we were leaving Urbana on 68 I heard what sounded like a motorcycle, so I thought there was a motorcycle behind me that needed to get around,” Jamison told News Center 7. “The next thing I know when I started to slow down, it came through the trees and into the field.”

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Indeed it's puzzling. That was quite an impact.

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    2. NTSB prelim confirms wingtip made that turf scar.

      Delete
  3. It appears looking at the current aircraft registration and the past FlightAware flights that this may have been a new owner. It does look as though he may have had a checkout two days prior to this crash. Very sad!

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    Replies
    1. FAA database: PPL issued 8/15/21
      3rd class med: 8/2020

      Delete
    2. Airmen Registry makes the pilot appear to be newly certificated with a 8/15/2021 certificate date, so I checked the citydata snapshot of Sandusky pilots from March 2016 and found him in that 2016 pilot listing with this entry:

      MARTIN HOWARD BEERMAN
      Medical Class 3 (Expires: Dec 2015)
      Licenses:
      Pilot : Private - Airplane Single Engine Land
      Pilot : Private - Instrument Airplane
      (From:http://www.city-data.com/pilots/sandusky-city-ohio.html)

      The current Airmen Registry has him as:
      Medical Class: Third Medical Date: 8/2020
      Certificate: PRIVATE PILOT
      Date of Issue: 8/15/2021
      Ratings:
      PRIVATE PILOT
      AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND
      INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE

      The Citydata snapshot cannot tell us how far back he was first certificated, but it wasn't 2021. Not able to determine whether the March 2016 citydata listing showing his medical expired at that time means anything.

      Delete
    3. Friendly reminder that date of issue of a cert does not necessarily mean that is when it was obtained. Being issued a new copy of a pilots license, not just passing a checkride, updates the date of issue.

      Delete
    4. This is correct. If you update your address with the FAA and request a new certificate, it will show that as a new issue date.

      Delete
  4. The TBM700 can apparently handle a lot of overspeed. NTSB reported that in the Corfu, New York crash of TBM700 N965DM, radar-derived ground speed rose to more than 340 knots during the high speed spiral dive. That aircraft did not shed any parts before ground impact.

    Corfu crash article:
    https://www.thebatavian.com/howard-b-owens/investigation-continues-into-cause-of-plane-crash-in-corfu/560267

    Corfu N965DM track:
    https://globe.adsbexchange.com/?icao=ad6f10&lat=42.969&lon=-78.383&zoom=13.7&showTrace=2020-10-02&leg=2&trackLabels

    Corfu N965DM preliminary report:
    http://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/Aviation/ReportMain/GenerateNewestReport/102077/pdf

    ReplyDelete
  5. Weather a factor? Icing? Pilot qualification? Recency? Aircraft familiarity? Human factors!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. He filed 20,000 feet, destination Cincinnati but started descending about five minutes after establishing 20K. Could have been handling a problem in contact with controllers but just got behind the aircraft as workload increased. Need to check LiveAtc.net.

      Absbexchange, big picture track w/alts labeled:
      https://globe.adsbexchange.com/?icao=a954eb&lat=40.641&lon=-83.690&zoom=8.2&showTrace=2021-08-20&trackLabels&timestamp=1629484217

      Flightaware showing filed flight:
      https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N700DT/history/20210820/1800Z/KPCW/KLUK

      Practice flight on the 18th?
      https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N700DT/history/20210818/1617Z/KPCW/KPCW

      High altitude operation was not an issue on 14 Aug flight:
      https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N700DT/history/20210814/1220Z/KBRL/KCLE

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    2. Great questions! I’m guessing number 3 and number 4. Maybe also number 1, and number 5. Don’t thinks it’s number 2 or number 6. Can’t think of anything else.

      Delete
  6. The certification date is the date of the last rating. Given the ratings it looks like he just got his instrument rating. It will be interesting to see what kind of training he got on this incredibly complex plane. Have to assume a new to this pilot plane. Likely needed IFR certification for insurance purposes.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The citydata Sandusky pilot snap shot of March 2016 shows him already instrument rated at that time.

      He may have been new to the TBM and relatively low total time or currency, but was instrument rated by March 2016.

      (When you look up pilots using citydata's not so up to date info, there is a last update date at the end of the list, makes it a handy tool to check back in time.) Link used on this check:

      http://www.city-data.com/pilots/sandusky-city-ohio.html

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    2. A change of address will also cause the issue date to be updated.

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    3. I knew the pilot and flew with him for over 20 years. He had just purchased the plane. He began flying in 1979 and was IFR rated for over 40 years. He previously flew a 201 Mooney and another plane after it, but I don't remember it was.
      He was meticulous about flight planning and was precise about what he did. I appreciate all of your insights.
      It is heartbreaking and such a shock to know how he died, but he was doing what he loved. He was a dedicated doctor and a wonderful father to his (biological) daughter, Katie.
      He is missed by many.

      Delete
  7. Several recent flights to/from Rice Lake Air Center in Wisconsin, they are a well known TBM repair center.

    ReplyDelete
  8. The Bonanza was the "doctor killer" of the 1970s but it's the TBM these days.

    There's a worrying trend of Private Pilots dying in the TBM, there was the Lawyer from NY last year. It's no wonder the insurance costs are astronomical for private pilots, it's far too easy to get behind the plane.

    ReplyDelete
  9. Here are photos and spec's of the airplane when it was for sale in 2013/2014

    https://www.aircraft.com/aircraft/1341741/n700dt-1998-socata-tbm-700

    Here are some photos from 2017

    https://www.facebook.com/170703149666424/photos/pcb.1578929358843789/1578922795511112/?type=3&theater

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    Replies
    1. The 2017 photo's are not correct, they are not the plane.

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    2. @al26 - Do you say that because you saw the original 1998 green paint scheme in photos dated as older than the Murmer aircraft services paint shop's 2017 Facebook posting?

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  10. Anyone think the fact that he had just maneuvered around some storm cells immediately prior to the decent could have been a factor at all?

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  11. It's most always the simple things that are the cause...new to him airplane, maneuvering around TRW's with autopilot, autopilot disconnects due to turbulence around the TRW's or because of operator error. Then suddenly attempting to hand fly a very complex airplane in IMC. About a minute and a half later the airplane is all over the place, and soon out of control. RIP.

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    Replies
    1. Yep. And just like that, it's all over...... Very sad to see all these highly intelligent and otherwise very competent folks getting in over their heads and killing themselves. They just don't know what they don't know.

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  12. First, I want to offer my condolences to the family of the pilot.
    Second, while I have no idea what the cause of the accident was but I do have some observations on the accident. I would like to hear your comments.

    Based on: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N700DT
    * altitude and flight path changes raise questions if weather was a factor.
    * was flight on 8/1/2021 a check out / familiarization flight.

    Based on: https://www.whio.com/news/local/state-patrol-responding-report-plane-crash-near-urbana/V24ZT74AZZD7LG6AUHIOZVDLNU/
    * eyewitness driving on 68 stated “When we were leaving Urbana on 68 I heard what sounded like a motorcycle, so I thought there was a motorcycle behind me that needed to get around,” Jamison told News Center 7. “The next thing I know when I started to slow down, it came through the trees and into the field.” If the aircraft was making that sound prior to impact it would seem to indicate the engine was still producing power.

    Based on overhead photos at: https://www.whio.com/news/state-patrol/7YD7VJN2URAQTPQPDJ6LE54X24/
    * I believe the tail was the initial point of impact and the aircraft was in a slight nose up attitude. The aircraft crossed the roadway fairly intact (based on minimal damage to roadway in photos) then went between the ground and power lines (based on some lines remaining intact in the photos) and impacted tree line. Appears some debris in tree line, in field red tail cone and part of vertical visible. Also appears engine/prop dark object almost at end of debris field.
    * debris field from point of impact to last visible pieces in photos is roughly 1800 to 1850 feet calculated from Google Maps https://www.google.com/maps/place/Urbana,+OH+43078/@40.0654626,-83.7752434,743m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x883f486e4e07d623:0xddefdfe528cdbac4!8m2!3d40.1083912!4d-83.7524298

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thank you for your condolences. Much appreciated.

      Delete
  13. Found final three and one half minutes comm on LiveAtc.net.
    Pilot and controller are heard loud and clear.

    The recording scans four frequencies, KDAY Dep/Gnd/Twr/App, so it contains clipped segments and may have missed some transmits entirely. A caution on this transcript: There is no way to know what is missed by LiveAtc's scan until FAA recordings are transcribed.

    Text shown below with parenthesis inserts obvious missed text when clipped, shows (---) when unknown, all caps=phonetic, and ... is used for gaps due to scanning. P@=Pilot, C@=Controller. Times are from beginning of the mp3 file and may differ on your playing.

    Pilot is crisp and speaks fairly fast, no slurring.

    P@5:35 "(Columb)us approach, good afternoon, seven hundred delta tango, wish you could send me to one one thousand"
    C@5:39 "(---)seven hundred delta tango, Columbus approach, good afternoon sir, the Dayton altimeter is three(---)...(desc)end and maintain one zero thousand"
    P@5:47 "...(---)thousand, seven hundred delta tango"
    ...
    C@6:28 "(---)yes understand, direct Lunken, but there's a disclaimer"
    ...
    C@6:33 "(---)yessir, clear direct Lunken, but there's a couple PAIR SHOON OUT zones up uh, near Midtown airport and Waynesville airport if you are familiar. I could vector you around those or want you direct?"
    P@6:41 "(---)direct Lunken at ten thousand feet and we'll look and see, thanks, seven hundred delta tango"
    ...
    ...
    C@9:58 "(---)ango, Columbus approach""
    C@9:06 "Seven zero zero delta tango, Columbus Approach. If you can hear me, acknowledge"
    ...
    C@9:25 "(---)zero zero delta tango, Columbus Approach."
    ...
    C@10:03 "(---)seven zero zero delta tango, Columbus Approach."
    ...
    C@11:01 "(---)seven zero zero delta tango, Columbus Approach."
    ...
    C@12:28 "(---)TBM seven hundred delta tango, Columbus Approach, howdooyah?."
    ...
    C@15:40 Controller requests another aircraft to call TBM seven hundred delta tango. The other aircraft makes the call several times on frequency (---)eighteen five, reports to Columbus that there was no response.

    https://archive.liveatc.net/kday/KDAY-Aug-20-2021-1830Z.mp3

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. One typo to fix: My C@9:58 time should have been 8:58 time.

      Corrected:
      C@8:58 "(---)ango, Columbus approach"

      Delete
    2. Re-listening to the initial contact, it may have been:

      P@5:35 "(Columb)us approach, good afternoon, seven hundred delta tango, with you descending to one one thousand"

      Still no idea what the C@6:33 zones near Midtown airport and Waynesville airport are.

      The front-clipped transmit at C@6:28 about a disclaimer almost sounds like the pilot's voice, but the scanner gaps make it hard to be confident of scan-clipped transmits without Columbus approach or N number bookending the content.

      Delete
    3. Likely that the C@6:33 zones near Midtown airport and Waynesville airport are the skydiving outfits at MWO, Middletown Regional and Red Stewart Airfield in Waynesville.

      Parachutes out...

      Delete
    4. C@6:33 "(---)yessir, clear direct Lunken, but there's a couple PAIR SHOON OUT zones up uh, near Midtown airport and Waynesville airport if you are familiar. I could vector you around those or want you direct?"
      This probably refers to parachute zones near Middletown and Waynesville airports, both have skydiving operations.

      Delete
  14. Parachute drop zones near Middletown...

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  15. Cloud bases are reported to be at sixteen thousand by a pilot at the 25:10 time mark of the LiveAtc KDAY recording. The controller's question about cloud base altitude is during the 23:23 to 28:00 mp3 file time period where Columbus approach is asking pilots to look for the lost aircraft.

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  16. So hypoxia can be eliminated right? It seems he was speaking clearly with no slurring at 20,000 ft (or at least after he had been at 20K for some time) and successfully acknowledged a clearance down to 10,000 ft. Medical emergency during the decent?? This is just weird...

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    Replies
    1. His altitude at the time of the parachute zone discussion (18:36:41Z if LiveAtc timing is right) was approximately 14,500 feet and still descending.

      The descent may have been to get below cloud bases, but if it was for cabin pressurization issues, it wouldn't make sense to rule out hypoxia as a possible factor in the outcome.

      An ongoing oxygen uptake deficit that didn't show up in comm speech at 14,500 could still result in a mistake setting up FMS for direct to Lunken and loss of control.

      Interesting study on mistakes made when slightly hypoxic:
      https://www.faa.gov/data_research/research/med_humanfacs/oamtechreports/1990s/media/AM97-09.pdf

      Delete
  17. in conclusion, with "The airplane wreckage was scattered at a distance of about 2,050 ft," the NTSB final report one year later starts with "The instrument-rated pilot lost control of the airplane" followed by conjecture.

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  18. My experience with high altitude training in the hypoxia chamber, going from 20,0000 to 22000 feet I lasted 8 seconds before slumping over. At 18000 I was lucid, answering questions and performing tasks. Hypoxia comes upon you very fast.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. @Leo - Where was the chamber located, what organization conducted that test profile and when approximately did you take that "hypoxia chamber" ride?

      Asking because altitude chamber flight protocols include 30 minutes of pre-breathing on oxygen at sea level to eliminate nitrogen so you don't get the bends when the flight profile depressurizes to altitude. Typical ascent is 5,000 feet per minute to 25,000 feet, then the oxygen mask comes off.

      You described a chamber ride where your oxygen mask was already removed at 18,000 feet to do a Q&A plus task performance check. Mask was still removed while going through 20K on the way to 22K.

      What was the total time duration from initial mask removal to slumping?

      Delete
    2. In 1978 my altitude chamber experience was a prerequisite for the US Army Free Fall HALO/ HAHO course, 1st Special Warfare Training Group (Airborne). It was conducted at Pope AFB. It’s been to many years to recall all of the exacts, and I understand our training was different than that of jet pilots.

      We had several excursions to different altitudes with masks coming off at intervals. Our max altitude was 30,000 feet. On the interval you describe, our masks came off at 18000. As we ascended through 20k I started to lose function and at 22k it was game over. At 22,0000 I lasted 8 seconds ( my recollection ) before slumping over as did most of my class.

      My point is and remains, hypoxia is nothing to take lightly. Most GA pilots never go through this controlled experience, and really have no idea of their tolerances. My airplane like many others is capable of 20k +,, and it is not pressurized. The B60 I’m in a partnership with is pressurized and fully capable of flight levels were you have but seconds to don a mask.. When I first flew with the two other owners, neither had any experience in an altitude chamber and didn’t know their limitations. Worse, neither had a immediate plan for the depressurization event. One of the first things I did was to have pilot/copilot dedicated masks on independent tanks installed, the masks within easy reach. When the alarm goes off, those masks are the first thing donned, before any checklist is opened.




      Delete
  19. Pretty big jump from a Mooney to a TBM, wonder if he went to FSI or Simcom. I just switched companies and I’m typed and well experienced in a bunch of single and multi engine turboprops and the company is sill sending me to FSI for initial in a single engine turboprop that I have quite a bit of experience in. I like that. Training is a big factor in keeping me and my passengers alive and I’m happy to be working for a company that sees things the way that I do.

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    Replies
    1. A jump from a 200 knot pressurized turbocharged Malibu to a 300 knot TBM is not a big leap. In fact it is a logical step. What else will you step up to in your first single engine turbine? The slower lower flying unpressurized Caravan? Man please...

      Delete
    2. So you’d be OK flying in a 737 with a pilot who learned the airplane by flying around with an instructor for 20 or 30 hours? Where did this silly notion of one airplane being a logical “next step” from another airplane come from anyway? I suspect that it originated in the marketing departments at Cessna and Piper. The reality is that every aircraft is unique and different and proper training teaches you to operate it in a safe and efficient manner. Every turbine engine aircraft that I’ve operated has serious dark corners, the ones where the devil lives, and proper simulator training teaches you to deal with these. You can’t get this education by just “flying around” with an instructor. That’s why I asked the question about training.

      Delete
    3. You're absolutely right, flying around doesn't cut it, and anytime transitioning from one AC to another necessitates training, and..., emergency procedures, which in a high performance AC can only be conducted in a simulator (safely). Even transitioning from one 737 to another (aka the Max) should have had extensive SIM time, as we all know now.

      Delete
    4. What the hell does a 737 have to do with a single engine prop aircraft?

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    5. And another thing: airline pilots start out in the right seat with little to zero real flight time out of the simulator. Everyone has a starting point. And your not answering my question about what is YOUR idea of the next logical step up from a Malibu in a high performance single is duly noted.

      Delete
  20. immediately prior aircraft owned was Piper Malibu Mirage, flown for at least 5-6 years or more

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    Replies
    1. He had 1,000 hours in the Malibu. It was a logical transition to the TBM. He attended ground school and flight training by a respected instructor and there was a practice flight around Port Clinton on Aug 18th for 1 1/2 hours.
      He was in excellent health and ran marathons. Gear and flaps were up and the Urbana airport was close by. Another eyewitness said he observed the intact plane in a nosedive. No fire, no explosion.
      It had to be hypoxia or an aneurysm. He was a private pilot and had his instrument rating for over 40 years. He flew often and maintained his aircraft. There were no shortcuts when flying.

      When reviewing fatal aviation accidents, I think it's important to consider that people who loved him may be reading comments. To assume that he was inexperienced, just got his IFR rating a few days before the accident, and was "otherwise competent" is very hurtful to read. Speculation is just that. You didn't know anything about him nor about his competence in flying.
      Just state the facts and please, don't make personal comments about someone you don't know. He was an amazing person and doctor and many of us loved him. Thank you.

      Delete
  21. emergency landing went terrible wrong. But he managed to avoid hitting the house at high speed.

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    Replies
    1. It was a crash, not an emergency landing.

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    2. An instrument rated pilot and wife flew from LI to Mass in their private plane and crashed near the destination airport. IMC, instrument rated, flew below MDA then corrected before crashing. NTSB report of spatial disorientation. The pilot was a heart surgeon flying his private plane. He was 65. One of my brothers and my mother was operated on by this surgeon.

      Perhaps single engine pilot operations in IMC may have higher loads on a pilot in complex aircraft compared to two pilot flights sharing duties in IMC.

      Delete
  22. The NASA ASRS database of voluntary pilot and controller reports is a good place to check for trends or common problems by aircraft model. There are 85 records for TBM700/850. Many of the 85 are procedural in nature.

    Two reports are of particular interest related to the N700DT accident, offered as info to this discussion without judgement. The two reports are not a trend and do not have additional occurrences in the database.

    ACN: 800529
    Aircraft Component : Rudder Trim System
    Problem : Malfunctioning
    Synopsis: A SOCATA TBM700 RUDDER TRIM RAN AWAY CAUSING SEVERE FLT CONTROL PROBLEMS. THE PILOT HAD HEADING AND ALT DEVIATIONS.

    I ADJUSTED THE RUDDER TRIM. THE TRIM SWITCH RESPONDED NORMAL AND RETURNED TO ITS NEUTRAL POS BUT THE RUDDER TRIM MOTOR CONTINUED RUNNING, THIS CAUSED THE LOSS OF THE ASSIGNED HDG. THE DEV WAS SEVERE TOWARDS THE R (S).
    (The full narrative describes difficulty keeping proper control while performing troubleshooting steps to regain control of rudder trim. Look up online at link below for full info)


    ACN: 624640
    Contributing Factors / Situations : Human Factors
    Synopsis: SOCATA TBM700 PLT HAD A RWY INCURSION AT SJC.

    I PURCHASED A NEW TBM 700 A MONTH AGO AFTER FLYING A MALIBU FOR 4 YRS. DURING THE MONTH, I FLEW WITH AN INSTRUCTOR FOR 50 HRS TO LEARN THE NEW ACFT. THIS IS THE FIRST TURBINE ACFT I HAVE FLOWN AND I FOUND THE LEARNING CURVE STEEP, WITH THE TURBINE, VERY CAPABLE MODERN PANEL AND A MUCH HEAVIER ACFT ADDING TO THE LEARNING CURVE.
    (Notable as a Malibu to TBM transition. Look up online at link below for full info)

    Link for report 800529 and 624640 lookup:
    https://asrs.arc.nasa.gov/search/database.html

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    1. For a direct read of the 800529 rudder trim runaway:

      http://www.37000feet.com/report/800529/socata-TBM700-rudder-trim-ran-away-causing-severe-flight-control-problems

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    2. Training training training. I’m in initial training right now at brand FS for a brand P turboprop that I already have a considerable amount of experience in but no real training. New employer runs every new pilot through initial at FS. Tonight I was at 250 in the box handling various emergencies that the mistress of doom was throwing at me and I lost control in a dive, way past the barber pole, but I DID recover. Mistress said she never saw anyone recover from that before, they always crash. Anyway I learned a little more about my plane and I’m happy for the TRAINING.

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  23. It is hard to understand this tragic accident for sure, lots of possibilities. A real sad tragedy no matter what the cause. Reading the training he had received made me think back to 1998 and my new TBM700 and what I did to transition from my previous plane of 17 years, a C337 to the TBM700, SN122.

    For starters, I spent 10 days in Tarbes, France for ground school and 22 hrs of day and night flying with the Socata Chief Test Pilot as my instructor for both. Christian was wonderful, and demanding. There was at first just learning to fly it, lots of takeoffs and landings obviously, and then all the simulatable emergencies were briefed and practiced in air, including decent and approach to landing with simulated engine failure, restarts after engine outs, gear failure and management, alternator failure, etc.

    It was a very tough 10 days, but at the end of it I had a French Type Rating for the TBM700. (Type ratings are not required in the US for the TBM, but I think they should be.)

    Next was flying the plane back to the US with my instructor Christian with two overnights nights on the way, and about 17 hrs of flight time for my logbook.

    Having done all of that training for my own basic safety, if I wanted insurance, I needed to fly another 80 hrs with a check pilot in the US, which I did. For my last training and check ride before I could solo the plane was to then go to FSI in San Ant├│nio for final ground school, including high altitude operations and emergencies, and an extended check ride in the plane before I was signed off, at last!

    I flew the airplane back to Tampa the next day and it felt great, and I was confident doing it, but I did not feel over trained!!! The TBM is a wonderful aircraft, but it is fast, nimble, and complex. As Christian told me in training, if you can fly a TBM, you can fly a twin jet. (Type rating always required!)

    I don't know what insurance companies are requiring for training of transition pilots at this point, but I'd like to.

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